Israel acting just like the nazis... again

Abused children often become abusers themselves.

It is going to be interesting when the Arab citizens of Israel become a larger percentage of their population. I think it's currently around 20% but they breed much faster than the jews.

The Nazi's were almost successful in their pursuit of a Jew free Europe, that's why the Israelis emulate them. If it weren't for the Allies kicking Hitlers butt, then I doubt there would have been too many Jews left.
Where are the Allies now? Backing Israel...and we wonder why the Muslim world hates us so much.

pirate, your rather unfair because the lock down is due to a direct threat of palestinian kids wanting to start a third intifada for god sake. They have been rioting day after day after day and they throwing rocks at jewish worshippers in the old city. What the hell do you expect the israelis to do???

Do you know why they are rioting? because israel wants to recognise some places in the west bank as being holy to Jews.

can you just try and be a bit even handed with the whole affair thanks. it doesn't take much to try and find out the other side and why israel does things.

That OLD video was of people from SDEROT who have been continuously bombed BY HAMAS for 8 FUCJKING YEARS. Of course they want their kumappence. goddam you. don't worry dude you can bet the entire gaza strip starts celebrating when a few israelis are blown up on the other side too.

Originally Posted by maccabean

pirate, your rather unfair because the lock down is due to a direct threat of palestinian kids wanting to start a third intifada for god sake. They have been rioting day after day after day and they throwing rocks at jewish worshippers in the old city. What the hell do you expect the israelis to do???

Do you know why they are rioting? because israel wants to recognise some places in the west bank as being holy to Jews.

can you just try and be a bit even handed with the whole affair thanks. it doesn't take much to try and find out the other side and why israel does things.

That OLD video was of people from SDEROT who have been continuously bombed BY HAMAS for 8 FUCJKING YEARS. Of course they want their kumappence. goddam you. don't worry dude you can bet the entire gaza strip starts celebrating when a few israelis are blown up on the other side too.

Comeuppance, retribution and all that other bullshit is irrelevant. There isn't any justification for bombing women & children. That goes for both sides. It just seems that Israel is more in the wrong here because they are the more powerful country that occupies and basically controls the west bank, they should be more responsible than that.

dude, this video is of a few loonies from sderot who you might say have a valid reason to see retribution being dished out. it does not represent israeli society.

All sides in this stupid conflict deserve scorn and derision.

Anybody within Israel or Palestine that is not openly advocating and persuing a peacful solution is part of the problem. If neither side will back down because of past and present atrocities on both sides then it will never be solved. Unfortunately the huge influence of religion on both sides means that this will likely be the case; War forever until one side commits or attempts genocide. How ironic if that turns out to be the Israelis.

Thing is though satori, while there's room for criticism on both sides, only one side is in a position to bring peace and they aren't serious at all about it, because they hold all the power so can continue doing what they want subjecting the other side to it. Until that side becomes serious about peace, there's no chance for the other to do anything to help bring it around.

The reality is that, until the Israelis come to terms with the fact their neighbours have the same rights they do, this cycle will continue.
Only when the French and the Germans found they were better off trading with their neighbours rather than trying to destroy them, only then could there be any real future.
And the same applies to every conflict zone across the world for the last thousand years.

So until the Israelis grow up, I am all for making gassing them a televised sport.

as i have maintained from day 1. israel is just defending itself. Large portions of palestinian society want israel off the map. Conversely I'd say 90% of israelis want peace if it means sacrificing large areas of land.

let me put it simple for you.
Palestinians want to eliminate israel. Its their stated ambition
israel has no intention of eliminating palestinians. Its their stated ambition.
thus israel is on the defensive and when israel fights back, it can very easily appear as if its the aggressor.

Fuck Israel. Holy Mecca, my ass. Need to drop a fucking bomb on it and wipe it clean.

Originally Posted by maccabean

as i have maintained from day 1. israel is just defending itself. Large portions of palestinian society want israel off the map. Conversely I'd say 90% of israelis want peace if it means sacrificing large areas of land.

let me put it simple for you.
Palestinians want to eliminate israel. Its their stated ambition

It is not nearly that simple. It is ridiculous to say that all Palestinians want the total destruction of Israel. Just like it would be ridiculous to say all Israelis are religious fundementalists. I do not believe that Hamas speaks for all Palestinians any more than the Zionists do for all Isrealis. Surely you must agree that for there to be peace, one side, or both, must cop a hit, no matter how atrocious without retalitation? How can there ever be peace otherwise?

israel has no intention of eliminating palestinians. Its their stated ambition.
thus israel is on the defensive and when israel fights back, it can very easily appear as if its the aggressor.

I have no sympathy for the war mongers of either side, but your statements make me think you drink the Israeli cool-aid too much. It is precisely the attitude you have expressed which is part of the problem. If Israel sees itself only as a victim in this mess, then it has it's eyes closed and there is little hope for the future of the region.

Has macca failed to notice that Israel breaches UN resolutions, is occupying illegal territory, and regularly attacks civilians?
And before he replies that Israeli civilians are targeted, let me point out that when Palestinians blow up Israelis, they are breaking the law. When Israeli soldiers shoot children, they are carrying out their government's policies.
Israel is creating a generation of new enemies. When they reap the crop, congratulations to them for their successful policy. Fewer and fewer of us will be sad for them.

Originally Posted by maccabean

as i have maintained from day 1. israel is just defending itself. Large portions of palestinian society want israel off the map. Conversely I'd say 90% of israelis want peace if it means sacrificing large areas of land.

let me put it simple for you.
Palestinians want to eliminate israel. Its their stated ambition
israel has no intention of eliminating palestinians. Its their stated ambition.
thus israel is on the defensive and when israel fights back, it can very easily appear as if its the aggressor.

Originally Posted by satori

It is not nearly that simple. It is ridiculous to say that all Palestinians want the total destruction of Israel. Just like it would be ridiculous to say all Israelis are religious fundementalists. I do not believe that Hamas speaks for all Palestinians any more than the Zionists do for all Isrealis. Surely you must agree that for there to be peace, one side, or both, must cop a hit, no matter how atrocious without retalitation? How can there ever be peace otherwise? .

i am talking in generalisations of course, but it seems that even from the news post, nobody seems to be shying away from painting a whole picture with one brush. Know what im talking about? Of course there is religion involved and poliitics and east vs west and bullshit like that, but stripped down im trying to tell you something.
that is, at the end of the day, israel has no reason to fight. it has borders to defend. israelis have a country. its the palestinians who want something. they want a country/nationhood - they want to get rid of this zionist entity. so they have all the reasons to fight. israel was created through the UN ok? obviously, the UN did not create palestine and now they are attempting to gain their nationhood through violence.

Originally Posted by satori

I have no sympathy for the war mongers of either side, but your statements make me think you drink the Israeli cool-aid too much. It is precisely the attitude you have expressed which is part of the problem. If Israel sees itself only as a victim in this mess, then it has it's eyes closed and there is little hope for the future of the region.

i think you have me mistaken. i only replied to this news post because of the one sided potrayal of the conflict. There is a large peace movement in israel that ensures the suffering of the palestinians is made well known to the israeli public.

Originally Posted by Aurelius

Has macca failed to notice that Israel breaches UN resolutions, is occupying illegal territory, and regularly attacks civilians?
And before he replies that Israeli civilians are targeted, let me point out that when Palestinians blow up Israelis, they are breaking the law. When Israeli soldiers shoot children, they are carrying out their government's policies.
Israel is creating a generation of new enemies. When they reap the crop, congratulations to them for their successful policy. Fewer and fewer of us will be sad for them.

yes yes yes, but whats the root of the problem? Why is this conflict still going and why did it start in the first place? We all know that both sides are at fault, but describing the consquence of the failure of diplomacy does not actually say anything about the reason for the failure.

Originally Posted by PsychoNavigator

a common but very misleading map. i mean, there was no palestine up to 1967, it was jordanian land and of course it fails to show taht in 1947 all the arab countries invaded to destroy it.

Originally Posted by maccabean

a common but very misleading map. i mean, there was no palestine up to 1967, it was jordanian land and of course it fails to show taht in 1947 all the arab countries invaded to destroy it.

Which they of course just gave it to Israel because all the fun is in invading the land and not keeping it for themselves, right?

Originally Posted by maccabean

a common but very misleading map. i mean, there was no palestine up to 1967, it was jordanian land and of course it fails to show taht in 1947 all the arab countries invaded to destroy it.

You mean Israel took over land populated by Islamic people who didn't think of themselves as Palestinian, and over the next several decades proceeded to absorb nearly all the land of the people who came to think of themselves as Palestinians?

Well, I guess that makes it okay then.

I mean, if they don't have a unifying national identity, then there's absolutely no problem with taking their land. After all, there was no lasting impact on the Australian Aboriginals when my ancestors did it to them, was there?

Before I start, listen to yourselves. If you replaced the words 'Israeli' or 'Jew' with ANY other nationality in this thread people would be sickened by the bigotry shown. Does (maybe unconscious) anti-Semitism still exist? Bet your arse it does!

As many of you know I am pro-Israel to some extent and I used to think much as macca does, that the vast majority of Israeli's want peace & are willing to give up land to get it. But then, again and again, govt's have been elected (in an extremely democratic country) with completely racist policies against the Palestinians. This has culminated in this pile of shit govt which thinks it is ok to go around using other peoples passports to assassinate political opponents, that thinks it is funny to sanction 1,500 new Jewish builds in East Jerusalem even whilst the US vice-president is in town to try and restart the peace process... the list goes on.

Until the Israeli people (who, I agree with Macca, and also on the basis of much experience, are in general decent, peace loving people) change their voting preferences I cannot support them wholeheartedly. It's easy to blame the voting system for giving small, extremist parties much power but at the end of the day if you don't like the result, don't vote them in or change the way your political system works.