Project: Fix the SamVia

[SamBo]

Today me and DumHed (ok, mainly dumhed, I stood and watched most of the time) started working on my car with it's dead engine.
Suspected head gasket blow-age.
So, we started taking apart the SR20DET engine, inorder to find out for sure here.
Here we have removed the Cam cover:
No Cam cover (http://www.zgeek.com/gallery/album65/nocover)

Once the cover was off, we started to take apart the cams. Was pretty messy as there was much oil around:
click me (http://www.zgeek.com/gallery/album65/nocams)

After that we found that the cams we rather worn and scorched:

click here (http://www.zgeek.com/gallery/album65/rockerarm)
and click me too (http://www.zgeek.com/gallery/album65/scoredcam)

Next step is to remove more bits and get to the head (tee hee hee, head). Hopefully replacing that will be all that is required to get the engine going again...

[C0V3R]

Looks like the cams havent had quite enough oil at one stage or another (hence the wear and overheating). Are you going to replace/regrind the cam? I assume youll be putting in new bearings at the least.

Do you know the history of the car? Any previous owners likely to have let the oil run a bit low or leave it in for too long?

No good to hear about the head gasket, but if thats all it is it wont be too expensive I guess ;)

[SamBo]

Don't really know much about the history of the engine.
I think we will be replacing the cams with those from a non-turbo SR20, so that should give a small boost in power too.

That is providing the only real problem here is the head gasket and not something else that's worse (in which case a new engine may be in order).

Not really suprised that there isn't much oil on the cams. after all, oil was covering the majority of the engine bay....

[C0V3R]

Originally posted by SamBo
Not really suprised that there isn't much oil on the cams. after all, oil was covering the majority of the engine bay....

Ahh this is no good *crosses fingers that the cyclinder bores aren't rooted, turbo hasnt sustained damage etc* Did you notice a drop in oil pressure prior to its death? Or does it not have a guage?

Good luck with the investigations.

[DumHed]

there's no oil pressure guage, but the oil light did come on briefly before the engine conked out apparently :)

There's still some oil left in the sump, so it's lots pressure due to leakage rather than running out.

The head has definitely been very low on oil supply to cause the scoring and heating.
Unfortunately we can't just replace the bearings and regrind the cams because they run directly in the head with no actual bearings.

Basically the head's looking like a throwaway, but we can use an n/a head to fix it, which saves dollars and will give slightly more power.

It looks like the engine probably had a leaking head gasket, which dropped the coolant level, and then the engine's overheated.
After heating right up it's then blown the gasket in a big way, and spat all the oil out.
There's oil all around the outside of the engine, and in the cylinders. No compression in all cylinders too..

Hopefully the bores are ok though, otherwise it's whole engine replacement time...

[THO]

I would like to see a picture of the underside of that head when you get it off the engine. Should be quite a spectacle. :)

[SamBo]

there shall be pics-a-plenty

[DrDivad]

Good to see a 1337 mobile getting repairing action action action action,

hopefulyl mine can get the same soon, it's sux to have no licence, double sux when the car don't even work anyway

[SamBo]

Originally posted by DrDivad
Good to see a 1337 mobile getting repairing action action action action

my car is far from 1337

[DrDivad]

1337 comes from within

[C0V3R]

Progress > 0?

[SamBo]

looking like new engine may be required... :(

[THO]

Why? (besides the blindingly obvious oil being sprayed about)

[C0V3R]

Pistons/cyclinder bores may be heavily scored or even seized due to lack of oil, turbo may have sustained damage (seized/damaged bearings causing shaft play etc), damage to crank and rod bearings due to no oil etc etc etc. Basicly any damage that can be sustained due to running with little/no oil is very likely.

[THO]

Originally posted by C0V3R
Pistons/cyclinder bores may be heavily scored or even seized due to lack of oil, turbo may have sustained damage (seized/damaged bearings causing shaft play etc), damage to crank and rod bearings due to no oil etc etc etc. Basicly any damage that can be sustained due to running with little/no oil is very likely.

Well, I figured that it was something like that. After the shots he posted of the rocker shafts and cam journals, I guessed the head might be expensive to fix. I don't really know much about nissan engines (though I drive one) except that they use a lot more bolts than other engines. I thought the block might have been spared. that sucks if he has to replace the whole powerplant, over here SR20det are about 5K.

[SamBo]

fortunatly, over here the SR20det engines are alot cheaper than 5k!

[THO]

I'm not surprised. The prices are jacked up over here because of the current riceboy fad. How does 2000$ for spoon cams sound?

[C0V3R]

Pretty damn crazy. Nothing that a decent cam grinder couldn't do. But then anything with a label like HKS, JUN, Spoon, Mugen etc is damn expensive.

[DumHed]

HKS cams here go for under $900 (au) :cool:

SR20DETs complete can be bought for not much over $1k, and whole S13 half cuts are 2.5-3k :)

Not much more info on the samvia, cos I spent yesterday fixing my car, which is now going! W00t!
The new turbo is surprisingly responsive, and 420km worth of hooning today didn't kill anything (except for a tank of fuel) so I'm happy :)

Although the battery has now died completely, so it's push start time :mad:

[DrDivad]

To be truly 1337 you gotta push start your own car, get 'er up to speed then run to the drivers seat and clutch her up! :P

i reckon self push starting competitions could be the go

[SamBo]

Engine and gearbox were removed last night. was quite... fun.....
Turbo and turbo manifold were then removed from the engine and Dumhed probably did more removaling of bits after I left last night

[SamBo]

DumHed is picking up the new engine today
He is also (hopefully) picking up an s14 turbo for me as well :D

[C0V3R]

Awesome! How many slabs (kegs even) is dumhead getting for all this? :D

[SamBo]

however many he wants!

[hazza]

pffft


the power of the iced vovo (volvo) is so much better than any turbo shitvia

[SamBo]

get out of my thread! :swear:

[DumHed]

hey it's my internet!

New engine's been picked up, along with the shiny new (second hand) T28 turbo from an S14a (cos the old T25G is cactus)

The rest of the stripping down of the old engine will be done tomorrow, and I'll take some pics too before I get too filthy :D

At the moment it's looking like the engine cooked because of a few reasons.
The head gasket was wrong (ie, from an S14/15 engine), and there was sealant used on it, which clogged some of the coolant passages between the block and head.

Some of the external fittings were intalled wrong too, which is what caused the water and oil to actually leak out.
The head is a throw away for sure, with badly scored cam journals, and at least one crack from a spark plug hole to the valve seat.

[DrDivad]

eek mega bushted!

[DumHed]

Well the old engine has been pulled apart completely.
It's not a pretty sight, with all bearings pretty badly grooved, all pistons damaged, sealant all through places it shouldn't be, and coolant passages clogged on the head gasket, so the engine was doomed from the beginning.

The thing that really tipped me off to the internal condition of the engine was the knock sensor, which bolts on the side of the block and senses abnormal engine vibration to warn the computer of problems.

as you can see, it's somewhat melted!

http://www.zgeek.com/albums/album65/knock_sensor.jpg

more pics here: http://www.zgeek.com/gallery/album65

[kré]

good game, previous engine builders. :cool:

[DumHed]

yeah, I'd like to give them a right good smack in the face.

Why waste a good engine by putting it together like a kid's toy in a sandpit?

[DrDivad]

megabork!

I'm afraid to look inside my engine...

[DumHed]

Well, some more work has happened on this project :)

The turbo is on the new engine, I've made up the intake pipe adapter for it, and sorted out the oil and coolant lines (which are a bit of a pain when going from a T25G to a T28 turbo)

There are a few other bits that need swapping over from the old engine, and then it's ready to go into the car!

here are some pics:
http://www.zgeek.com/gallery/album65?&page=3

[SamBo]

Awesome Sick Mate!!!! :D

[DumHed]

OK, now the turbo plumbing has been finished, S15 dump pipe installed (with the S13 O2 sensor fitting swapped over), flywheel installed, oil catch can installed, temp sensor replaced, fuel rail and throttle position sensor swapped over, and various things sorted out.

Next is putting the clutch and gearbox on, then fixing up the geartick hole in the floor, and probably replacing the leaking clutch master cylinder before the engine goes in.

[DumHed]

well, tonight I've checked the spark plugs, re installed the coils, wiring and cover, bolted the engine mounts on, installed and aligned the clutch, and bolted the gearbox onto the engine.

Now it needs the alternator, starter, and power wiring installed and the engine's ready to go into the car.

[C0V3R]

Almost there!
Good luck on the first fire up

[Jaz]

Now this the way to own a car. One that you know inside out. (or in this case Dumhed)

If only ppl would be the same with their computers.

[DumHed]

now it has the alternator, starter motor, and power wiring done.

I also pulled some of the dodginess off the inside of the car where the auto gear selector cover was still there - causing major access problems to the gear stick. That caused a few issues when we removed the old engine.

I might even get around to putting the engine in the car tomorrow night if there's nothing else too critical to do in the mean time.

It does need the clutch master cylinder replaced though, which is mega easy while the engine's out so I might try to do that first.

[SamBo]

woah!
that's bloody awesome!
Madd props to DumHed for his help in this! Can I have your children??? :)

[sagit]

Originally posted by Jaz
Now this the way to own a car. One that you know inside out. (or in this case Dumhed)

If only ppl would be the same with their computers.

you mean like a kit car? (and I mean kit and not KITT) :p

[Jaz]

Originally posted by SamBo
Can I have your children??? :)

lol. That has an evil ring to it when the person said to is engaged/married.

[SamBo]

Originally posted by Jaz
lol. That has an evil ring to it when the person said to is engaged/married.

we all know he loves it :)

[Cassa]

:mad:

[SamBo]

Originally posted by Cassa
:mad:
awww I'm sorry Cassa.
Ok, you can have all the babies you want.... just dont tell me about it

[SamBo]

Lost night the S15 intah-coolah went into my car. We had to use the piping off my S13 cooler, which meant we first had to remove the rat-shit gaskets on those pipes... took us a while to do that.
The pipes are clean and on the S15 cooler and an air scoop was fitted to the cooler before Dumhed installed it in my car (was a rather tight fit).
Have also cut an air-intake hole in the front bumper so the intercooler can actually work properly now.
Next is fixing/replacing the clutch master cylindar (the one in there now is leaking) and replacing the stupid loud/inefficient exhaust.
Almost there now.... :D

[DumHed]

foollliiiiii siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiik!

http://www.zgeek.com/albums/album65/newenginefront.jpg


that is all.

[SamBo]

that is probably the sickest thing I have seen all year!

[SamBo]

I believe the zorst is now made up and installed

[DumHed]

yep, all the intake piping is also on, and the @#@#%%^ pod filter adapter and stuff is connected. (spent half the night fixing stuff that had been done wrong by the monkey that did the original conversion.

Now it needs:

engine oil and filter change - done

Gearbox oil filled - done

Gearstick re installed - done

clutch fluid filled and bled - mostly done

remaining couple of exhaust bolts done up - done

inner guard liner clipped back in - done

bonnet re installed

wheels back on


It might even be possible to fire it up tonight :)

edit: done stuff marked, and it runs! w00000000000t!

[SamBo]

large amounts of W00t!

Test drive tonight?

[C0V3R]

Awesome!
My car might even be working soon too!
Just dropped it off at the exhaust shop to have the purty ceramic coated headers put on (and to rid me of the horrible exhaust leak)

[SamBo]

oh no! cracked radiator! :eek:

[DumHed]

damn steenking radiator!

now all the intake plumbing has to come off again too!


Ahh well, I seem to have lined up a replacement one for a good price.

[SamBo]

Originally posted by DumHed
Ahh well, I seem to have lined up a replacement one for a good price.

Good work dude! you da man! :p

[DumHed]

w00000000000h0000000!

It's going, and back on the road :)

Seems to behave itself quite well too, and goes pretty hard even at only 5psi!

[SamBo]

was running quite smoothly actually! was nice to drive it again.
It sounds great too, like it really growls, and not just a loud stupid noise like it did before.
The fluttering is nice too :p

[Drakin]

When you say fluttering, are you talking about the "whub whub whub whub" sound when the wastegate opens?

Is that a good thing? I would have thought the wastegate was supposed to dump enmass as opposed to squeezing them off like a girl in bed??

[DumHed]

you're thinking of a Blow Off Valve, or more specifically - an atmospheric venting Blow Off Valve.

The SR20 silvias actually came with a factory BOV, which is of the recirculating, or "plumb back" type, and doesn't really make a noticeable noise.

Sambo's car doesn't have one at all (was missing, and some of the necessary pipe work is also missing), so after spooling up some boost and closing the throttle the built up air pressure tries to force its way back out through the turbo, causing pressure waves and the choof choof sound. (sik mate sik)

Heaps of people confuse the BOV with the wastegate, and the back off flutter sound with "wastegate flutter", which is totally different.
The wastegate bypasses some of the exhaust gas around the turbine, to keep the boost level constant as the engine speed increases. Generally you don't hear the wastegate in operation, except that the exhaust note changes a bit as it opens up - because the turbine isn't quietening the exhaust as much.

[Drakin]

Ah right so a BOV can flutter and happens when you back off, a wastegate shouldnt flutter and is used when stomping on it to avoid sending excessive pressure to the engine.
Wouldnt the excess pressure waves trying to push back through the turbo cause issues?
I could imagine it would disrupt the power curve causing one of those knobly curves, but i can also imagine a world where there is a lane per person and speed limits are based on experience.. :D

[DumHed]

yep, the wastegate is used to control boost, by limiting the flow of exhaust gas through the turbine - which it does by letting some of it go straight out, bypassing the turbo.

The BOV is generally fitted to reduce the flutter noise on factory cars, and also can help with throttle response on gearchanges - because the turbo doesn't slow down as much when you back off the throttle.

Aftermarket BOVs are usually of the atmospheric type, so they release the air with a loud ptschhhhhh sound for extra rice value.

The pressure forcing itself back through the turbo can cause damage, like snapped turbo shafts, and excessive wear in the bearings, but generally that's only a worry at reasonably high boost levels. Most of the flutter sound happens at very low boost, especially if you back off the throttle just as the turbo has spooled up.

[SamBo]

The samvia is back in my possession now. I hooned it around a bit last night, trying to get a feel for it (sorry chatswood).
It feels pretty good. Sounds grunty and runs smooth. Turbo doesn't kick in until rather high revs, but when it does it certainly pulls nicely!
We'll wind up the boost on it eventually though.

Just a couple of things need to be ironed out, but nothing major.

Madd props to DumHed for an excellent job! :banana: :banana:

[sagit]

watch out syderney!

:D

[SamBo]

Originally posted by sagit
watch out syderney!

:D

Werd!

[SamBo]

The Samvia now has a fulliiii siiiiik shiney blue strut brace in it :D

[SamBo]

Finally put the car on a dyno for the first time ever. I wasn't really expecting much (and i didn't get much). 122.8kw at the rear wheels. Pretty much standard. Was running mega lean after 5500rpm so the fuel pump shall need to be upgraded (as we suspected it's most likely still got the CA18DE fuel pump in there).
It was actually the first time i've been to a dyno and was really interesting to see the other cars going. There were some very impressive figures from some people!

[AsterisK]

my new car is 102kw stock. hmmm might have to get a high flow filter and extractors. see if that can match your ~122kw ;)

[kré]

my new car is 102kw stock. hmmm might have to get a high flow filter and extractors. see if that can match your ~122kw ;)
102kW rating stock would be at the flywheel, not the wheels. regardless, a high flow filter and extractors would not give you anywhere near 20kW.

[SamBo]

I'm hoping to have a pretty big improvement once I get a decent exhaust (i still have the stock dump pipe running from the turbo) as well as the fuel pump. Put a bit more boost into the turbo and things should be sweet :D

[AsterisK]

here's to dreaming then :P

[kré]

I'm hoping to have a pretty big improvement once I get a decent exhaust (i still have the stock dump pimp running from the turbo) as well as the fuel pump. Put a bit more boost into the turbo and things should be sweet :D

i knew there was something wrong with my car. it needs a dump pimp :cool:

[SamBo]

i knew there was something wrong with my car. it needs a dump pimp :cool:
I hate you :cool:

[SamBo]

Since my last post, car has had the following bits added/changed:
1) Old ca18de fuel pump removed and replaced with fuel pump from an s15 200sx
2) Complete new exhaust with 3" front/dump pipe, high flow cat and (almost) 3" straight through exhaust (off dumheds old silvia). Still have stealth looking exhaust tip (not the same as before though)
3) Now running at 8-9 psi.

Dyno next weekend. Expecting to see quite a considerable increase in the power figure since the last run (122.8rwkw)

[Davo_Dinkum]

*seven thumbs up*

Where abouts you doing the dyno?

[SamBo]

Unigroup at Girraween

[SamBo]

142.2kw at the rear wheels. I'm pretty happy with that :D

[Davo_Dinkum]

142.2kw at the rear wheels. I'm pretty happy with that :D

nice, impressive.

[kré]

that's a big jump

[DumHed]

yeah that's very healthy power for a very mildly modded engine at that boost level.

It sounded very nice on the dyno too.
No more exhaust leaks and the larger diameter piping really cleans up the note.

It should pull well over 150rwkw with a few extra psi of boost, but coming into summer it's good to keep the boost low with the fairly small intercooler.

[Cassa]

How long til you get 2hp on the bike then?

[DumHed]

I'm going to train up for the next dyno day!

[SamBo]

that bike needs a turbo

[DumHed]

already sorted :)