Monaro in the UK

[SirStevo]

Hey all, I am currently on holiday in europe and what did I see on my way to Heathrow airport in London but a nice shinny Monaro. I talked to the driver briefly while stuck in traffic and was glad to hear that it retained the 5.7L V8 engine, in england cars have much smaller engines than they do back in Oz. There are a total of 50 Monaros brought over and they are under the Vauxhall badge. Vauxhall also do the Corsa (Barina), Astra and Vectra. Anyway I just wanted to share the fact that the aussie muscle car had made it to England.

[sapience]

it was featured on a show called top gear and they said it was awesome.

[MisterFlibble]

Originally posted by sapience
it was featured on a show called top gear and they said it was awesome.

I saw that too... it beat a Jag :) Take that you pommy bastards. lol

So it was a little slow off the mark, but it still managed to outrun the Jag. Mind you, a corner probably would have made the race completely different (it was a drag strip).

The guy that reviewed it, loved the way that it handled, without any kind of TCS, or any of that expensive anti-roll stuff you see in more expensive cars.

[beerbaron]

If anyone wants that movie its a www.racingflix.com under roadtests

How funny when driver/reviewer says " a world of smoke and looking where your going through the side window "

heheheh gotta love sideways circle work action ,

[MisterFlibble]

I just love the look on his face, and the way he says "I think I've won" when he outran the Jag.

*bogan voice* Go the Monaro! :banana:

[V_Max]

Like most Holden products it went alright in the dragrace but when they took it for a hot lap it wasn't very special...

[MisterFlibble]

Originally posted by V_Max
Like most Holden products it went alright in the dragrace but when they took it for a hot lap it wasn't very special...

True... but when the reviewer driver drove it, he seemed to be more impressed with the fun factor of it (which lets face it, fun is probably one of the most, if not THE most important things), rather than the speed at which it could go around the track.

Having said that, it was slightly faster than the Audi TT.

[beerbaron]

VMax agreed
but that was a wet lap too
beating the ferrari 575 and being close the golfrs32 and Mercedes SL AMG 55

Overall not bad

[pinchy]

Originally posted by V_Max
Like most Holden products it went alright in the dragrace but when they took it for a hot lap it wasn't very special...
It won the Bathurst 24 hour, I think thats pretty special. It beat the Ferraris, Porches, BMW M3s....

[V_Max]

:rolleyes: Hint - just because the badge says Monaro, doesn't make it the same as what you can buy down at the Holden shop (unlike the Porsches, Ferraris etc to a large extent)

What's special is the rules that allow Holden to compete with that thing.

[Benwah]

Originally posted by pinchy
It won the Bathurst 24 hour, I think thats pretty special. It beat the Ferraris, Porches, BMW M3s....

nah, it didn't we are talking different cars, the car that won bathurst was the HRT 427ci concept car, hand build practically (which I've had the pleasure of seeing circle eastern creek on a private track day, sounds AWESOME!)

The Monaro that they sell both here and the UK is a commodore with 2 doors and a big engine (plus some clever bits and pieces) at the end of the day its the same chassis as a taxi ;)

[MisterFlibble]

at the end of the day its the same chassis as a taxi ;)

Wouldn't that make it a Falcon then? :D

[Benwah]

Originally posted by MisterFlibble
Wouldn't that make it a Falcon then? :D

Most states of australia base taxis on both Commodores and Falcons, Ford have a bit of monopoly in Sydney, but last time I was in Melbourne lots of the orange taxis were Commodores, dunno about SA and WA. In QLD I spotted the odd Commodore taxi.

[MisterFlibble]

Originally posted by Benwah
Most states of australia base taxis on both Commodores and Falcons, Ford have a bit of monopoly in Sydney, but last time I was in Melbourne lots of the orange taxis were Commodores, dunno about SA and WA. In QLD I spotted the odd Commodore taxi.

Yeah, I've seen the odd Commodore taxi in Sydney. Seen one in Melbourne when I was there last.

You just spoiled a perfectly good joke with facts! haha

[Benwah]

oops, sorry bud, I had my serious hat on again.

BTW, Here's something I'll tell ya'll for free, NEVER buy an ex taxi.

[Necron]

Originally posted by Benwah
Here's something I'll tell ya'll for free, NEVER buy an ex taxi.

What gave it away?. The 'extra K's on the clock or the ammount of times the brakes have been replaced?. Or was it the scores of times that the engine has been rebuilt!.

[MisterFlibble]

Could of told you that... haha. Can't tell you how many taxi's I've been in where the guy driving it:

a) smelled like decayed, well, anything dead.
b) was using the stickers normally seen on the dash (the ones advertising cabcharge, etc) to hold together his bumber.
c) had covered numerous warning lights (air bag failure warning, oil light, battery warning) on the dash with stickers, or a picture of some religious figure.
d) and just general, not careness of the vehicle.

Go for an ex highway patrol car... at least they've been chipped, and the cops take reasonable car of them too.

[MisterFlibble]

Originally posted by Necron
What gave it away?. The 'extra K's on the clock or the ammount of times the brakes have been replaced?. Or was it the scores of times that the engine has been rebuilt!.

haha... you assume that there was any kind of maintainence done to the car since it rolled off of the production line.

[pinchy]

Originally posted by Benwah
nah, it didn't we are talking different cars, the car that won bathurst was the HRT 427ci concept car, hand build practically (which I've had the pleasure of seeing circle eastern creek on a private track day, sounds AWESOME!)

The Monaro that they sell both here and the UK is a commodore with 2 doors and a big engine (plus some clever bits and pieces) at the end of the day its the same chassis as a taxi ;)

I stand corrected!

[sapience]

the best taxi's to get in the uk are in bradford, the driver completely ignores you, and bangra music is on really loud.

[Benwah]

Originally posted by Necron
What gave it away?. The 'extra K's on the clock or the ammount of times the brakes have been replaced?. Or was it the scores of times that the engine has been rebuilt!.

nah, mechanically they are usually pretty good as they are typically rebuild before they are sold, I'm talking about REALLY scary things like bend chassis and panels that have been vibrated for so long they can fall off at any time.

[That Bloke]

Originally posted by SirStevo
they are under the Vauxhall badge. Vauxhall also do the Corsa (Barina), Astra and Vectra. Anyway I just wanted to share the fact that the aussie muscle car had made it to England.

Vauxhall, Holden, Isuzu, Suzuki, Opel are all General Motors.

Most of their cars are global(although the styling of the US brands is not used much elsewhere).

The Holden Commodore is The Opel/Vauxhall Omega(with a far greater range of engine options including Lotus tuned quadcam V6s & even Turbo Diesels), The current Monaro was(in non V8 form) the Opel/Vauxhall Monza, The Holden Camira was The Vauxhall Cavelier & the Opel Rekord(I think) etc etc.

[Benwah]

Heres more Opel/Vauxhall trivia, the Vauxhall Opel 1985-1991 design was purchased by Daewoo and built in 1992-1996 as the original Daewoo Hatch 1.5i

Recycling!

The Opel Astra:

[Benwah]

the Daewoo

[hooptieride]

Isnt the monaro exported to the UK a HSV GTS or GTO?

[Benwah]

Dunno, in the US it's badged as the Pontiac GTO I think - the turber charger version ;)

[hooptieride]

Originally posted by Benwah
Dunno, in the US it's badged as the Pontiac GTO I think - the turber charger version ;)

Yes I know that. The pontiac GTO is a monaro with a few body and engine tweaks, whereas to my understanding the 'Monaro' available in the UK is a HSV GTO or GTS.

Im not sure if im right or not can anyone correct me?

[That Bloke]

Originally posted by hooptieride
Yes I know that. The pontiac GTO is a monaro with ............. engine tweaks,

Engine wise it's a 300kw LS1/CA18 but it is detuned down to about 270kw for the US market.

[beerbaron]

The pontiac gto is essentially a stock standard monaro cv8
except the different front end styling etc
mechanically it pumps out about 10 - 15 more killowatts due to less restrictive exhaust system ( makes for better noise too for the us market )
as for the uk markets
Monaro will be sold in 2 guies
stock standard monaro ( same as oz market )
and a hyped up version, ( which is the HSV version sold here )

[scathing]

Originally posted by pinchy
It won the Bathurst 24 hour, I think thats pretty special. It beat the Ferraris, Porches, BMW M3s....

You mean the "Monaro" that runs the 7.0L V8 out of a Corvette C5R? An engine that isn't even available for street use, let alone in a showroom Monaro, yet is still competing in "production car" racing? Racing in a competition where the competitors have to keep their standard engine blocks, and are limited on what modifications they can do?

Good on ya. :rolleyes: Any person who thinks that the Monaro is a winner when its running that engine is even more of a retarded zealot than Nodbugger.

Tell you what. Get a Ferrari 360 Corsa Stradale (which is a road car), put the 360 GT bodykit on it (its not like Nathan Pretty's Monaro runs a Holden or HSV bodykit either), let them drop the engine out of Michael Schumacher's current company car into it, and we'll see how well your Monaro does.

[V_Max]

The real question, of course, is whether the mongrel 360 would get far enough ahead in the 4 hours it'd run for, to give them time for an engine change before the Commodore thingy caught up again :D

Ferrari 360 Corsa Stradale <Picky-bastard Ferrari nutter>Challenge Stradale :)</PBFN>

[pinchy]

Originally posted by scathing
Good on ya. :rolleyes: Any person who thinks that the Monaro is a winner when its running that engine is even more of a retarded zealot than Nodbugger.

You're a little late of the mark there... if you read a few posts down, I was corrected and admitted i was wrong (something noddy will never do). I initialy thought that the Bathurst Monaro was a production car like the others, but now I know better...

[V_Max]

I initialy thought that the Bathurst Monaro was a production car like the others And that's why some of us hate it so bloody much! I'm not picking on you here pinchy, just a general comment because a lot of people think the same as what you did. If they made it clear that it is far removed from it's production-line (distant) relative, then I woulnd't have a problem with it at all...

[scathing]

Yeah, missed that.

I just get the shits with people think that the Nation's Cup Monaro resembles the road going version. It has about as much in common with a Monaro as Skaifey's V8 Supercar does with a Clubsport.

Anyway, people keep crowing about how quick the Nation's Cup Monaro is. Well, when you drop a fully race developed and prepped Nascar car engine into a field where the competitors still have to run the street-car blocks, its no surprise that its quick.

I was at Eastern Creek for Procar a few weeks ago, and down the straight the Monaro pulls away from a Lamborghini Diablo. I don't think anyone would believe that, short of twin turbochargers, a LS1 equipped Monaro would ever be able to decisively pull away from a 6L V12 Lambo.

Of course, Stokell reeled Pretty in through the back section and ended up passing him, so it goes to show that a well-sorted package is still superior to mass horsepower.

Speaking of which, if you put Marcus Ambrose's Falcon V8 Supercar up against Satoshi Motoyama and Richard Lyons' JGTC 350Z (the JGTC is Japan's premier touring car category, so basically like their version of the V8 Supercars), even with the 100hp defecit they'd still shit all over a V8 Supercar.

One of the JGTC teams brought their Supra down to Queensland during summer for hot weather engine testing. After a weekend of testing and knowledge of the track, on near-dead tyres (they weren't using fresh stock since they weren't handling testing), they still lapped Queensland Raceway 7ish seconds below the V8 Supercar record. And those guys weren't even the front runners.

[pinchy]

I thought it was a bit convinient that they won the race near the car's release.... So the race was pretty much rigged in favour of the "Monaro" then?

[V_Max]

V8 Supercar lap record - 1:11.0033 (Garth Tander, Commodore VS, 1999)
Formula Holden lap record - 1:04.1618 (Simon Wills, Reynard 94D, 1999)
Alleged JGTC laptime - ~1:04.0033

Something doesn't add up there??

[scathing]

I don't have a problem with the Monaro, personally. I quite like it, aside from the front (which is still too Commodore). I'd still own one, but not as an only car. There are other cars I'd prefer to buy if I had the money for a Commodore coupe (whether in Holden or HSV guise).

But, if I could afford to make an ultra-expensive project car, I'd build a really tough Monaro. It'd probably be a mix of Jap import and old school rodder styles. So you'd get a wide bodykit and the shopping list on the flanks, but fully shave the exterior details for that smooth look and a chrome intake like I was running a supercharger (I'd actually go twin turbos instead).

[scathing]

Originally posted by V_Max
Something doesn't add up there??

What doesn't add up?

[V_Max]

That a JGTC car can be as quick as a Formula Holden :confused:

[Chopper]

So which is better, Ford Falcon or Holden Commodore?

[scathing]

Originally posted by V_Max
That a JGTC car can be as quick as a Formula Holden

Why not? While the car is a big bigger (it weighs in at around a ton) it does make 500hp, while being carbon fibre over spaceframe, full inboard suspension, and ground effects (I believe) or at least much greater aerodynamic aids than V8 Supercars.

Each team also has a budget that would practically pay for the entire V8 Supercar field.

Lets put it this way - they get ex-Le Mans racers competing in the GT500 class.

The GT500 cars don't have too many parts common to the street cars, but then a V8 Supercar doesn't share that much with your average SS Commodore either.

[Benwah]

neither, they are both taxies! with engines designed in the 1950's and the handling of a tractor with flat tyres ;)

[Chopper]

Originally posted by Benwah
neither, they are both taxies! with engines designed in the 1950's and the handling of a tractor with flat tyres ;)

my sentiments exactly :D

[V_Max]

scathing - I just can't see a car with a somewhat worse power:weight ratio, more weight overall, less downforce, a much higher CoG and I imagine less grip per unit weight, being as quick as a FHolden... I can't pick a single area where the JGTC car would outperform a proper open wheen racecar.

Edit - for what it's worth the GT500 lap record at Suzuka is a 1:55 and although I can't find an FNippon record, a random pick of the most recent qualifying session there finds a top time of 1:46. Yes, FNippon cars have more power, but otherwise they're the same thing - many FHolden cars are ex-FNippon.

[scathing]

Just had a look around at some numbers, and yeah it does look a little suss.

The JGTC record (1:24.303) is slightly faster than the F3 record (1:26.400) on Fuji Speedway, but on Eastern creek the F3 record (1:27.912) is a fair amount higher than the Formula Holden record (1:22.513).

It'll come down to drivers etc as well, since its not the same driver on those circuits.

I'll try finding more info on it.