On Cheney, Rumsfeld order, US outsourcing special ops, intelligence, to Iraq terror

[DOGG]

The Pentagon is bypassing official US intelligence channels and turning to a dangerous and unruly cast of characters in order to create strife in Iran in preparation for any possible attack, former and current intelligence officials say.

One of the operational assets being used by the Defense Department is a right-wing terrorist organization known as Mujahedeen-e Khalq (MEK), which is being “run” in two southern regional areas of Iran. They are Baluchistan, a Sunni stronghold, and Khuzestan, a Shia region where a series of recent attacks has left many dead and hundreds injured in the last three months.

One former counterintelligence official, who wished to remain anonymous due to the sensitivity of the information, describes the Pentagon as pushing MEK shortly after the invasion of Iraq in 2003. The drive to use the insurgent group was said to have been advanced by the Pentagon under the influence of the Vice President’s office and opposed by the State Department, National Security Council and then-National Security Advisor, Condoleezza Rice.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/US_outsourcing_special_operations_intelligence_gat hering_0413.html

[Nodbugger]

What the hell kind of source is this?

[AhhDiddums]

What the hell kind of source is this?

I remember in a debate about Cuba and their healthcare quality on here, you used incredibly biased right-wing links for ex-Cubans who support conservative views. So, it seems to me that you really don't have much of a right to bitch about people's sources on here.

[IamSpartacus]

Nod*, do you have any ability at all to read a book or use internet search engines ?.

Dogg's posting gives you a starting point to research further. For example, after a few measly clicks I happened upon this chap ...

www.cooperativeresearch.org/context.jsp?item=us_plans_to_use_military_force_ag ainst_iran_1984

February 14, 2005

Newsweek reports that there is disagreement in the Bush administration over what to do with 3,800 Mujahedeen-e Khalq (MEK) fighters being held in custody by the US at Camp Ashraf (see April 2003).

The magazine says that parts of the Defense Department want “to cull useful MEK members as operatives for use against Tehran, all while insisting that it does not deal with the MEK as a group.” They would be sent to Iran to gather intelligence and possibly reawaken a democratic movement in Iran. The CIA however has objected to this strategy “because senior officers regard them as unreliable cultists under the sway of Rajavi and her husband,” Newsweek explains.

A Defense Department spokesman however denies there is any “cooperation agreement” with the MEK and claims that the Pentagon has no plans for using MEK members in any capacity.

But an MEK official interviewed by Newsweek said the opposite: “They [want] to make us mercenaries.” Representative Brad Sherman, a Democrat from California, also feels the Defense Department has plans for MEK members. “The Defense Department is thinking of them as buddies and the State Department sees them as terrorists. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle,” he told Newsweek. [Newsweek, 3/15/2005]


So, considering other sources I have to hand, looks like this 'year old' news is ongoing and gathering momentum. US govermental organs ... lepoard never changes its spots.

[Nodbugger]

I remember in a debate about Cuba and their healthcare quality on here, you used incredibly biased right-wing links for ex-Cubans who support conservative views. So, it seems to me that you really don't have much of a right to bitch about people's sources on here.

Their health care was crap, and no it wasn't a biased right wing source. It was a link from the Red Cross.

[Nodbugger]

Nod*, do you have any ability at all to read a book or use internet search engines ?.

Dogg's posting gives you a starting point to research further. For example, after a few measly clicks I happened upon this chap ...

www.cooperativeresearch.org/context.jsp?item=us_plans_to_use_military_force_ag ainst_iran_1984

February 14, 2005

Newsweek reports that there is disagreement in the Bush administration over what to do with 3,800 Mujahedeen-e Khalq (MEK) fighters being held in custody by the US at Camp Ashraf (see April 2003).

The magazine says that parts of the Defense Department want “to cull useful MEK members as operatives for use against Tehran, all while insisting that it does not deal with the MEK as a group.” They would be sent to Iran to gather intelligence and possibly reawaken a democratic movement in Iran. The CIA however has objected to this strategy “because senior officers regard them as unreliable cultists under the sway of Rajavi and her husband,” Newsweek explains.

A Defense Department spokesman however denies there is any “cooperation agreement” with the MEK and claims that the Pentagon has no plans for using MEK members in any capacity.

But an MEK official interviewed by Newsweek said the opposite: “They [want] to make us mercenaries.” Representative Brad Sherman, a Democrat from California, also feels the Defense Department has plans for MEK members. “The Defense Department is thinking of them as buddies and the State Department sees them as terrorists. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle,” he told Newsweek. [Newsweek, 3/15/2005]


So, considering other sources I have to hand, looks like this 'year old' news is ongoing and gathering momentum. US govermental organs ... lepoard never changes its spots.


If he is going to pull this crap, why should I be the one expected to research into it further?

If he present some shit hole source, I'm going to assume it is a shit hole article until a better source is given.

Even your link is crappy, it never directs you anywhere, it only says thing. They are analyzing things other sources say, they are assuming and they are not presenting facts in any way, shape , or form.

[IamSpartacus]

Nod*, I'm sure that the only things that your ever believe are
(a) what your daddy tells you,
(b) what your President tells you.

I do get the impression that you are a sort of political agnostic ... in as much as you hope your country is doing well, you hope your goverment is tellling you the truth, you hope your military is behaving honourably, and you hope your incumbent President isn't a cunt .... and secretly fear that there will be some magic bullet of a source of information which will shatter your illusions.

Rather than you posting simple derision, how about some constructive argument for a change ?. In the meantime, try reading between the lines too.

[Scythe]

Threads like this are why I rarely bother with the War forum any more. Either discuss the story or don't post.

Turning this thread into yet another attempt to argue with Nodbugger over trivialities is an utter waste of everyone's time.

[DOGG]

They're keen to take intelligence on iran from this anti-iranian 'terror group'.

"The State Department says MEK is a terror group. Human Rights Watch says it’s a cult. For the White House, MEK is a source of intelligence on Iran."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7902719/site/newsweek/

[AhhDiddums]

Their health care was crap, and no it wasn't a biased right wing source. It was a link from the Red Cross.

No, I specifically remember at least two of the maybe four or five links you gave, being from these "free Cuba" organizations.

[Up_All_Night]

i remember you arguing that even though cuba has better infant mortality rates than the USA, the USA rate was better, using the statistics that its better in cuba to support your case or some shit.

But even if you dont like the source, it doesnt mean the topic isnt worth debating.

[Nodbugger]

i remember you arguing that even though cuba has better infant mortality rates than the USA, the USA rate was better, using the statistics that its better in cuba to support your case or some shit.

But even if you dont like the source, it doesnt mean the topic isnt worth debating.

The population growth rate of cuba is about a third of what the US has. Cubans are having less children than Americans.

[s3raph]

The population growth rate of cuba is about a third of what the US has. Cubans are having less children than Americans.
Yeah but its the rate that shows the effectiveness of the healthcare system in that regard.

[Nodbugger]

Yeah but its the rate that shows the effectiveness of the healthcare system in that regard.

In what regard, Cuba has 1 baby per 100 people compared to Americas 50 babies per 100 people? (These aren't exact numbers or factual)

But when someone has less to take care of at a less frequent rate, the ability to keep everything quality goes way up.

In the US any idiot can go out an have a baby, in Cuba they seem to be much more traditional in when and who has babies.

[darns]

Threads like this are why I rarely bother with the War forum any more. Either discuss the story or don't post.

Turning this thread into yet another attempt to argue with Nodbugger over trivialities is an utter waste of everyone's time.

I feel your pain. I also rarely read the War forum beyond the FIRST post anymore. Most FIRST posts by DOGG are informative and definately beats having to go searching around for latest war subjects.

Beyond that, once Noddy comes in the thread turns into shit and everyone starts to argue with him over trivial matters although everyone realizes that noone ever wins any arguement if Noddy is on the other side.

Should just change the "War Forum" into "Noddy's Crap" and then move the real War forum into discussions - plus ban Noddy from the new discussion based War forum.

Yeah that...

[darns]

Yeah but its the rate that shows the effectiveness of the healthcare system in that regard.

Give up. The meaning of statistics and mathematics are beyond him.

"Rate" is just a number.

[berserk]

Yeah but its the rate that shows the effectiveness of the healthcare system in that regard.
Not this shit again. I thought I had already proved statistically that the birth rate has no relationship whatsover with the infant mortality rate.

[Canalien]

...I'm going to assume...

Speaks volumes.

[Nodbugger]

Not this shit again. I thought I had already proved statistically that the birth rate has no relationship whatsover with the infant mortality rate.

How does it not? If they didn't have any babies there would be no mortality rate.

[DOGG]

lol - he doesn't even get it

Poor thing. Someone should put it down already

[Scythe]

Should just change the "War Forum" into "Noddy's Crap" and then move the real War forum into discussions - plus ban Noddy from the new discussion based War forum.

I vaguely recall that the War forum actually used to be a sub-forum of Discussions, but the proliferation of derailed threads like this one is why it was moved.

[s3raph]

In what regard, Cuba has 1 baby per 100 people compared to Americas 50 babies per 100 people? (These aren't exact numbers or factual)

But when someone has less to take care of at a less frequent rate, the ability to keep everything quality goes way up.

In the US any idiot can go out an have a baby, in Cuba they seem to be much more traditional in when and who has babies.
Well a high infant mortality rate in a country that controls some sixth of the worlds wealth is still a pretty poor effort. I mean a nation as rich as the US should easily be able to manage highest life expectancy, lowest infant mortality, etc etc. As it stands I'm pretty sure those honours currently belong to Norway.

[Nodbugger]

Well a high infant mortality rate in a country that controls some sixth of the worlds wealth is still a pretty poor effort. I mean a nation as rich as the US should easily be able to manage highest life expectancy, lowest infant mortality, etc etc. As it stands I'm pretty sure those honours currently belong to Norway.


We have people who don't allow that to happen.

[Evil Dan]

We have people who don't allow that to happen.

Republicans ?

[Enos]

We have people who don't allow that to happen.

Well that's the first time I've heard you say something bad about your government, there's hope for you yet.

:boxing:

[Nodbugger]

Well that's the first time I've heard you say something bad about your government, there's hope for you yet.

:boxing:

It isn't the government, it is the citizens, there are people here who I wish I could just kick out.

Have you ever watched COPS?

[Enos]

It isn't the government, it is the citizens, there are people here who I wish I could just kick out.

Have you ever watched COPS?

I try to avoid intelligence sucking programs such as those, in fact I rarely watch tv.

That you watch it surprises me not one whit.

Oh, and I was being sarcastic earlier. As the poster boy for right wing america I know you'd never say anything bad about your government, mores the pity.

[ms edeity]

Oh, and I was being sarcastic earlier.
Nooo. I don't believe it.

[Enos]

Nooo. I don't believe it.

Unfortunately, it does need to be spelled out to non-primates :p

[jasebert]

This message is hidden because Nodbugger is on your ignore list.

Makes the war forum a better place.......

[Jimma]

Good link DOGG and an interesting read.

[Nodbugger]

I try to avoid intelligence sucking programs such as those, in fact I rarely watch tv.

That you watch it surprises me not one whit.

Oh, and I was being sarcastic earlier. As the poster boy for right wing america I know you'd never say anything bad about your government, mores the pity.


Wow, you really are an idiot.

COPS isn't an intelligence sucking program. It shows people that there are some incredibly retarded people out that. If you hadn't gone all jackass you may have seen my point in mentioning that show. Instead you demonstrated your stupidity instead of looking at all outlets of society.

[Javaxcx]

COPS isn't an intelligence sucking program. It shows people that there are some incredibly retarded people out that.

There sure are. :D

Kid, you've got to stop alluding to TV and movies to make your point. The metaphorical value of them, while occasionally enough, is comparable to bullshit and pig feed.

[darns]

Wow, you really are an idiot.

COPS isn't an intelligence sucking program. It shows people that there are some incredibly retarded people out that. If you hadn't gone all jackass you may have seen my point in mentioning that show. Instead you demonstrated your stupidity instead of looking at all outlets of society.

I don't need to watch COPS, I simply read the War Forum.

Har har har har.

[Nodbugger]

There sure are. :D

Kid, you've got to stop alluding to TV and movies to make your point. The metaphorical value of them, while occasionally enough, is comparable to bullshit and pig feed.


COPS is real footage of actual events. You will never experience idiots like that unless you are a cop or watch the show.

Stop being a jackass.

[Seeker]

COPS is real footage of actual events. You will never experience idiots like that unless you are a cop or watch the show.

Stop being a jackass.

This is untrue actually, while there are certain levels of idiocy, you will find the levels on cops while working in retail, property managment pretty much any service provided to the general public.

[Nodbugger]

This is untrue actually, while there are certain levels of idiocy, you will find the levels on cops while working in retail, property managment pretty much any service provided to the general public.

Not in the same context though.

[Seeker]

Theft, assualt, drugs and in the case of property managment murder, break and entering, domestic violence, vagrancy, assualt also, drugs more so, the list is no different to that of the police.

I only say this due to my dealing with both the morons on cops and the cops themselves pretty much on a day to day basis.

[Javaxcx]

COPS is real footage of actual events. You will never experience idiots like that unless you are a cop or watch the show.


Schwing! Right over your head.